The Army Corps of Engineers have posted the Environmental Assessment (EA) Public Notice for the BNSF Intermodal Facility between Gardner, KS and Edgerton, KS. The Public Notice includes links to the Draft EA and the Preliminary 404(b)(1) Evaluation.
The following statements are taken directly from the Public Notice:
"The Corps has made a preliminary determination that the proposed IMF would not have a
significant adverse effect on the quality of the human environment; therefore, the filing of an
environmental impact statement would not be required.
In addition, the Corps has made a preliminary determination that the project is in compliance
with the Section 404(b)(1) Guidelines. The preliminary 404(b)(1) evaluation has resulted in a
conclusion that use of the discharge site is not prohibited by 40 CFR 230. There are no less
environmentally damaging practicable alternatives. The activity does not appear to: (1) violate
applicable state water quality standards or effluent standards prohibited under Section 307 of
CWA; (2) jeopardize the existence of Federally listed endangered or threatened species or their
habitat; (3) violate requirements of any Federally designated marine sanctuary. The activity will
not cause or contribute to significant degradation of waters of the United States including
adverse effects on human health, life stages of organisms dependent on the aquatic ecosystem,
ecosystem diversity, productivity and stability, and recreational, esthetic, and economic values.
In addition, (4) appropriate and practicable steps have been taken to minimize potential adverse
impacts of the discharge on the aquatic ecosystem."
go to www.gardnerkansas.gov click on city government, city council and mayor e-mails are in the contact information at the top of the page
retiredwrote on 7/22/2009 11:07 am
Does anyone have the email addresses for the city adminstrator, mayor,and council members? I can not find them on the city website. thank you
Outsidelookinginwrote on 7/21/2009 1:05 pm
I have no problem educating myself, I have significantly educated myself so far. I have been researching this issue for the last 3 years. While some might do research to defend their position, I do research that encompasses the entire picture. If you have specific info on police and fire calls at elwood then please supply the link/contact info so I can verify for myself. I would like to determine for myself what "the majority" of calls means. I have a problem with terms like - "the majority of", "most of", "alot", "some of", "everybody".... These terms do not actually reflect research. A statement as a certain percentage of overall calls would reflect research. I would expect overall calls to increase if a large development was dropped into a relatively small developed area.
Please provide studies/research that contradict the studies supplied in the Corps Draft EA and I will study those as well. Please do not continue to reference studies that were done by agencies that ONLY considered California. While I will 110% agree that pollution is a serious issue, I also believe that our government(Federal, State, Local) will enforce all applicable laws relative to any industrial operation. I have no other choice.
If you were to read the Corp's Draft EA you would find that ALL applicable federal and state agencies have done studies that concluded that there will be no or minor adverse environmental impact from the KC logistic park and intermodal development. Similair effects were determined for the "no action alternative". You would also find that the ONLY potential pollution issue with the development is post-construction fugitive dust emissions. This is the same thing generated by gravel roads and farming. The developing parties will be required to moniter this and mitigate as necessary to meet air quality standards.
Since I live 400 yards from the SE corner of the development, you should understand that I am SIGNIFICANTLY intersted in the impacts. So please do not assume that I am not doing my homework. I would invite ALL to study(educate yourself) the Crop's Draft EA and the associated doucments. There may be info there that will assist in defending one's position, then again enlightenment(educate yourself) might be to much to seek.
wrote on 7/20/2009 9:27 pm
Outsidelookingin: You might want to read Elwood police and fire department calls since the majority of them are for the Elwood intermodal and educate yourself or is that asking too much?
Outsidelookinginwrote on 7/20/2009 11:38 am
Interesting that the videos did not show thick black clouds of diesel smoke, illegial alliens hopping off trains, hookers on street corners, terrorists with weapons of mass destruction, barren land caused by toxic/fuel spills, or crumbling roads.
If you are willing to do without the items that we purchase everyday then we would not need to have such facilities. If citizens would be willing to give up their current lifestyles and become totally self sufficiant then we would not require the big distribution systems that we relay on to bring us the "STUFF" that we can not seem to live without.
wrote on 7/19/2009 4:06 pm
You want truckers and trucks - here is what you are dying to get. Real quality of life.
'The People" have their EI study in the Corp's Draft Environmental Assessment which is the main part of the 404 permit evaluation. The Draft EA includes a section "Affected Environment and Environmental Consequences" that addresses land usr, air quality, noise & vibration, socioenomic conditions, community & recreational resources, roadways & traffic, geology & soils, prime farmland, water resources, vegetation & wildlife, threatened & endangered species, cultural resources, visual & aesthetic conditions, hazardous materials, rail safety and utilities.
The Draft EA was prepared with cooperation from various state and federal agencies with their extensive imput. Each segment of the environmantal evaluation was completed with an associated study which is also part of the Draft EA as appendix attachments.
Everyone might want to read the documents so they will have the facts to defend their respective positions.
Aviswrote on 7/18/2009 1:00 pm
'Anonymous' would like you to view the video links they posted on the Edgerton budget story.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/17/2009 6:15 pm
Thanks for the input
wrote on 7/17/2009 5:30 pm
Paul: I'm guessing the group is quiet on purpose. If the Army Corps Eng or EPA wouldn't allow intermodal then they wouldn't have to sue. If the economy was too weak to build, there is nothing to fight. Why play your cards until you need to? Just keep throwing up hurdles one by one as needed to drag this out and keep your oponents guessing. If you come off too strong, the opposition will mobilize. Sneaky and slow works. Look how successful they were with the election. People thought that the intermodal annexation was a done deal. The new council might be tougher to deal with on the details, which might be a good thing, but we assumed that Gardner was already committed to the annexation and agreements. Surprise!
Paul Joneswrote on 7/17/2009 5:13 pm
Why has this group been so quite? Nothing to stand on or what? If they had so much proof why keep it a secret.. When I believe something I speak out. Like many other citizens.
wrote on 7/17/2009 3:16 pm
Again, the people need a full environmental impact study done before the inland port/intermodal should even be considered - that needs to be done now and not later.
wrote on 7/17/2009 1:41 pm
ooops, typo. That's diesel "plume" not "plum".
wrote on 7/17/2009 1:33 pm
Correction: according to article, HELP stands for Hillsdale Environmental Loss Protection.
Of course, except for spokesman "Gardner resident Bryan DeMars" none of the "200 members" are named.
According to the article DeMars said the stakes are too high to ignore. He believes the facility will create a diesel plum that could drift toward local structures such as Gardner-Edgerton High School and be deposited on nearby ground. "This will kill everybody. This will shorten everybody's life within five years." It would be interesting to interview DeMars to get the full story in context, instead of just these sound bites.
wrote on 7/17/2009 9:58 am
how can we find out who the members are in the HELP group. public record or not?
wrote on 7/16/2009 9:33 pm
These pushback lawsuits may be the cornerstone of Councilwoman Peter's faith that intermodal will not come.
wrote on 7/16/2009 6:31 pm
Bryan DeMars and the Hillsdale Environmental Group (HELP) are mentioned in the lead story of the Gardner News (7/15). You have to be a subscriber to the online version of the paper to see the whole story, or buy a paper at a newstand now. (The new paper will be on newstands on Friday, replacing this one.) Looks like the HELP group wants to file a lawsuit against the Army Corp on Aug. 1, the day that the public comment period ends. According to the article, those involved with HELP say that the intermodal will have long term effects on the environment and that similar projects in California and Oregaon have had problems with diesel spills, air pollution and increased traffic. The article goes on with quotes from DeMars and Councilman Hale.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/16/2009 5:19 pm
Thank you very much
wrote on 7/16/2009 5:15 pm
there was this from last year....
http://www.scribd.com/doc/1029512/Bryan-DeMars-on-the-proposed-BNSF-Intermodal-Rail-Yard-near-Gardner-Kansas
Is there something else?
Paul Joneswrote on 7/16/2009 4:20 pm
Does anyone know Bryan DeMars, with the HELP group, 200 people plus him, talking about some cloud over High School,or something like that, quoted in that Gardner paper thing...
wrote on 7/15/2009 8:03 am
Edgerton: I give you the project with great joy and my humble gratitude to some Council members who ACTUALLY govern for the people and not the big boys - wondered if I ever would see the day, especially since the old status quo has about ripped every dollar I have in my pocket and had big plans to get the last one left.
HEHEwrote on 7/15/2009 7:11 am
Way to go Edgerton, Thanks Gardner!!
wrote on 7/13/2009 9:53 pm
One thing I got out of the council workshop is the new Coleman plant will be giving our Parks over 100000 a year....
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 9:33 pm
Would you post the comments of a business person who supports the Intermodal?
My question is this: what the heck does the questionable need of the stimulus money have to do with whether or not the Intermodal is built (which it's going to be anyway) or whether or not the Intermodal is going to kill us with its diesel fumes?
If we want to debate the necessity of the stimulus or where the Congress and the current administration send the money, that's a great discussion. But it's not relevant to what we've been discussing, ad nauseum, about our own Intermodal and city government concerns.
Actually, like your business person, I smell a LOT of rats tied to the stimulus money. But while being a business person who works in both the US and Canada and who doesn't like stimulus money is impressive, the opinion of said business person in our discussion carries pretty much the same weight as anyone else who chooses to offer their opinions on the topics. Maybe it carries slightly more weight because of the person being in business, but maybe it carries less because the person doesn't necessarily live here (you didn't tell us one way or the other) and because the person him or herself as a "Political Moderate" before chiming in with his or her opinion.
The net result is that the business person's opinion carries the same value as anyone else. Do you feel it should carry more?
wrote on 7/13/2009 7:54 pm
"The earth provides enough for all of man's needs but not enough for all of man's greed" - Ghandi
wrote on 7/13/2009 6:01 pm
don't worry has defently sucked on to many tailpipes, don't loose any sleep over it , I would not of had that much patiance. good job
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 5:48 pm
"No credibility", huh?
At least you consistently fall back to insults and seeing demon motivations behind, not only those who disagree with you, but also behind those who would dare to offer you a truce.
What ARE you afraid of? When have I attacked anything but your own statements, insults, and what I perceived (in my opinion) to be your illogic? Did you see me making fun of you ailment by suggesting that you were "sucking tailpipes"? Did you see me calling you a liar or making up out of thin air what -I- felt your motivations were?
When have I done anything more nefarious than question the bile that you've dumped on people? Am I THAT evil for daring to disagree with you?
Ah well. It was a stretch for me to assume that you might accept any profferred olive branch or that you would would even consider holding yourself to a standard that whereupon you might constrain yourself from treating people like trash.
To everyone else, I apologize for my lengthy rant here. I should've known better. At least I tried, though.
wrote on 7/13/2009 5:26 pm
Jdel: You have shown your true colors too many times in the past on this site for anyone to fall for this ploy of yours - you have no credibility. People will not waste their time or efforts with you.
**********
With respect to another matter I have read comments on this site telling how the Legends and the race track have brought such wonderful times to taxpayers in Wyandotte Co. I would encourage anyone to compare property and personal property taxes on a $200,000 home and 2008 Ford 150 pickup in Wyandotte and Johnson County and see what you get. Just a few moments ago the local news headline was that the Wyandotte Co. Unified government is facing the biggest budget problems EVER. Property taxes are down and delinquent property taxes have greatly increased. So having a race track, the Lengends or an inland port/intermodal will not solve the tax and budget problems and I believe the facts would show these projects just add to the people's financial problems but the politicians and the special interests sure don't sell that truth.
So citizens study the issues carefully, do extensive research and educate yourselves - utopia is not handed to you and never will be - anything worthwhile is earned thru hard work, patience and realizing that politicians normally are selling you something that is too good to be true just like the scam artists and even go so far sometimes of overlooking or turning their heads from many adverse affects to the people.
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 4:05 pm
And there you have why you don't find many supporters out here (or apparently in Gardner).
When people offer you sympathy or even the smallest portion of acknowledgement of the positions you support, you insult them and call them liars.
At any rate, despite everything else, I truly AM sorry that you are afflicted with such severe respitory problems. In the name of civility, I once again offer an olive branch to you so that we can argue the issues at hand instead of taking the discussion to the point where it's all insults and name-calling. I would hope that you would take me up on it and hold me, others, and yourself to that standard.
Then again, I've seen enough of your posts to suspect that my offer will, once again, be rebuffed. Maybe it is easier to think that the rest of the world really IS against you - because even when it's not, you seem to try that much harder to make it work out that way.
Ouchwrote on 7/13/2009 3:56 pm
What do you think is more hazardous to your health, sucking on the tail pipe of a truck or stressing about the destruction of the good people of Gardner night and day? Toss up...
wrote on 7/13/2009 2:55 pm
Jdel: I have seen too many of your postings to think for a minute you sypathize or give a rat's --- about someone who could suffer from the pollution the inland port would bring to our people. Go find some other suckers.
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 2:30 pm
1:59 - First, let me say that you have my sincere sympathy for the suffering your asthma/breathing problems cause you. Mine are fortunately mild most of the time, but I know how difficult they can be, especially for someone who is sensitive enough to have an asthma attack triggered by even incidental contact with smoke.
Knowing that you, yourself, suffer from respitory problems helps us to understand some of the vehemence with which you post on the subject.
That said, I'm not sure we can find a way to suit, both the inevitable growth of Gardner as the metro swallows us (like it has so many other suburbs), and the needs of people for whom the hazards of urban living represent a challenge and threat to their health.
In short, should Gardner simply turn away businesses that cater to, or use, diesel trucks in order to preserve some small portion of our airspace for the citizens who are most sensitive to pollution?
Say we somehow block the Intermodal and end up, instead, building a big box store of some kind on the land. Or a mall. Or maybe even the Lowe's that they were going to build elsewhere. Would the diesel smoke levels coming from the trucks needed to support one of those types of facilities be low enough to make life easier for you? What if that wasn't enough for you or for one of our other citizens? What ELSE would we have to omit from our city?
And even if we COULD prevent all that from happening inside Gardner, what about the pollution that comes from OUTSIDE our borders (and for the sake of my argument here, I won't use "Edgerton's Intermodal" as an example. But what IF the county or other municipalities eventually build up pollution-producing industries or businesses that bring in a lot of trucks and/or trains? How do we control that to preserve/prevent the pollution from affecting our most sensitive citizens?
I'm really NOT trying to be clever here. At some point, the metro WILL swallow up Garder and our ability to preserve the rural community that Gardner USED to be will evaporate. While we can do our part to make sure we don't invite in businesses that will prematurely end our rural identity, we ALSO need to be realistic about keeping control over the things that we CAN control when the businesses are going to come to our area anyway.
As for your health, I reiterate my sympathies to you. I, of course, can't speak for you, but if I was faced with a threat to my overall health because of the encroaching metro, I might look to moving to an area where I could live more safely.
BTWwrote on 7/13/2009 2:22 pm
And by the way, the Intermodal Facility is still coming.
Intermodalwrote on 7/13/2009 2:14 pm
For being so much against the intermodal I find it interesting that you would want to be driving out around the facility to get stuck behind one of those trucks.
And no, I don't believe they are going to be driving up and down main street or parking themselves in front of the Dolphin Song. I can't hardly stand driving up and down main street myself with everyone stopping to turn and hitting all the red lights with no green arrows.
wrote on 7/13/2009 1:59 pm
Are you serious what are ya gonna do hold your breath, you think there has to be a cloud of dust or smog for your lungs to feel the effects? No the Air in general will contain more particulate matter from emissions, these are things people like me (sensitive to diesel exhaust)FEEL in their lungs shortly after getting behind one of them and having it come in my car vents, and one can never escape it completely which is why I will probably never be able to quit taking inhaled anti inflammatories/ bronchodilators daily. What starts as a tickle, is followed by a burn then wheezing and then congestion the next few days. And sometimes an instant headache, Not plesant and Im not looking forward to having to breath it more. Sorry any good reason to have a big new business come to town will never be worth that to me or my lungs
The wind never stops blowing in Kansaswrote on 7/13/2009 1:44 pm
What happens to the fumes and exhaust when the wind blows? Does it not move or dissipate or does it just immediately settle into our chests?
I remember back in 2006 when we met in the high school to talk about the Intermodal coming and John Q Public, (Claude Hobby) talked about the cloud of pollution that would settle of the high school.
My first thought was. The wind never stops blowing in Kansas is that possible? And then I thought, are there other clouds of pollution stalking the population somewhere and if there are why haven't we seen them on the news or are they like UFO's or something?
wrote on 7/13/2009 1:30 pm
I know that a sprawling freight distribution complex is about to be plopped down in the middle of our towns and we will have more irritating fumes to breath in. And if you can honestly find me someone who thinks the traffic and the fumes will just be peachy. I'll dance you a jig!
Am I part of the problem?wrote on 7/13/2009 12:53 pm
@Linda
You love to compare Argentine to Gardner, yet your comparison is like apples to oranges.
I asked if anyone knew what the intermodal was, and you spewed Argentine.
Argentine is an intermodal PLUS a hump classification yard, PLUS a locomotive service facility, PLUS fuel islands to refuel through trains.
Your comparing Argentine to Gardner is a stretch at best.
Why don't you do your homework before you pretend to know what you are talking about.
Heinzwrote on 7/13/2009 11:03 am
No Name, have you ever watched the "Conspiracy Theory?"
Heathwrote on 7/13/2009 10:50 am
From the online edition of The Encyclopedia Britannica's entry on Special Interest Groups:
any association of individuals or organizations, usually formally organized, that, on the basis of one or more shared concerns, attempts to influence public policy in its favour. All interest groups share a desire to affect government policy to benefit themselves or their causes. Their goal could be a policy that exclusively benefits group members or one segment of society (e.g., government subsidies for farmers) or a policy that advances a broader public purpose (e.g., improving air quality). They attempt to achieve their goals by lobbying—that is, by attempting to bring pressure to bear on policy makers to gain policy outcomes in their favour.
All sides in this argument are Special Interest Groups, including BNSF, TAG, TAKE BACK GARDNER, etc. etc. So no name, you need to realize that you are part of your own Special Interest Group, competing against another.
wrote on 7/13/2009 10:41 am
Heintz: Sorry you haven't figured that out yet.
Heinzwrote on 7/13/2009 10:17 am
I would love to know who the special interest groups are, or at least who you think they are.
wrote on 7/13/2009 10:04 am
So glad the majority of the voters within Gardner, Ks. gave us representatives who could not be bought and paid for by the special interests. Gives you hope for tomorrow and lets you know the people know what has been going on now for numerous years and wants no part of it.
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 9:56 am
One more time...
You've illustrated with your lengthy EPA study that, yes, pollution can cause problems. You haven't shown us how much pollution we expect to get in Gardner from the Intermodal.
IS the Intemodal going to create smog in Gardner all by itself? Did the studies you cited on ozone mention where they were being taken? Was it in KC or in an area like Los Angeles (keeping in mind that LA gets a lot of its smog because of its unique geography, sandwiched between the ocean and a mountain range that traps pollutants more effectively than in many cities)?
We KNOW that pollution is bad. But when you try to take all the worst info of the worst pollution and concentrate it onto a single intermodal hub in Gardner, you stretch your credulity quite a bit.
(And next time, you might just give us a link to your sources instead of copy-and-paste. We can follow links and read them for ourselves).
Heinzwrote on 7/13/2009 9:47 am
Does that mean we can sue trucking companies for all the deaths their exhaust causes. People sued big tabacco right? In that case the sky is the limit.
All the doom and gloom around here is depressing.
Oh yeah, the Intermodal is still coming BTW.
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 9:44 am
The point I'm making here is that if we only read "evidence" that we agree with, we're not really giving ourselves a good view of the whole picture. Did you notice that I used the 404 EA as an example of an air particulate study when it is, instead, a wastewater assessment? Anyone can use (or misuse) facts to make them sound like what they want.
What I'm trying to get at is the whole picture, not pieces of it. So I WANT to hear about the damage we can expect from the Intermodal, even though I've been arguing for it out here. Seem inconsistent? Not for someone who wants to look at the problem as objectively as possible.
It's not inconsistent of me to acknowledge that pollution is a problem, but to also question your apparent claims that the Intermodal is going to turn Gardner into smog-filled Los Angeles. Or even the massively industrial Argentine district. It's not inconsistent to note that diesel particulates can cause airway distress for people sensitive to them, but to ALSO note that diesel particulates aren't the only pollutant, or asthma irritant, that we find in the air. It's not inconsistent that I believe we ought to do what we can to minimize the pollution we're going to get WHEN they build the Intermodal in Gardner, but also that I question the so-called experts who keep trying to tell us that we're all going to die because of it -- especially when those experts can't seem to dig up any objective causality info.
Like a lot of us here in Gardner, I'm TRYING to keep my mind open and look at all sides of the issue. Using hand-picked facts to try to paint a single side of the issue doesn't help us address the problems we face.
Scientific study FROM THE EPAwrote on 7/13/2009 9:38 am
just one of the study findings from the EPA on
Effects of Ozone on Pulmonary Function and Airway Inflammation in Normal and Potentially Sensitive Human Subjects
Objective:
Ozone is a common air pollutant and a major component of smog. The current National Ambient Air Quality Standard (which is currently being revised) is 0.12 parts per million (ppm), a level not to be exceeded for more than one hour, once per year. This standard is based largely on evidence that, in sensitive individuals, short-term exposure to ozone causes symptoms such as cough and shortness of breath, and reversible changes in some tests of lung function.
A procedure called spirometry is commonly used to measure lung function, particularly the measurement of forced expiratory volume in one second (FEV1), which is the volume of air a subject can forcibly exhale in the first second following maximal inhalation. Exposure to ozone causes a transient decrease in FEV1 in many people. This response is highly reproducible within an individual; however, there are marked differences among individuals in their sensitivities to ozone. Ozone also can cause the airways to become hyperresponsive to inhaled substances (such as the drug methacholine) that constrict the large airways or bronchi; this response is reflected in the airways becoming increasingly resistant to air flow. Finally, inhaling ozone can produce airway inflammation and cell injury, as evidenced by the appearance of cellular and biochemical markers of these reactions in airway fluids.
This report describes the results of two independent studies that were designed to (1) evaluate the range of ozone-induced responses in the general population, (2) study the effects of short-term exposure to ozone in populations with underlying airway inflammation (smokers and people with asthma), and (3) compare the responses in sensitive populations with those in normal subjects. A common goal of both studies was to characterize ozone-induced responses in populations thought to be most sensitive to ozone so that appropriate standards can be set to protect human health.
The studies described in this report were conducted by two investigator groups: Dr. John Balmes and colleagues of the University of California, San Francisco, and Dr. Mark Frampton and associates of the University of Rochester. Drs. Balmes and Frampton used similar ozone exposure regimens but different study populations: normal and asthmatic men and women exposed to 0.2 ppm ozone or clean air for four hours in the Balmes study, and male and female nonsmokers and smokers exposed to 0.22 ppm ozone or clean air for four hours in the Frampton study. In both studies subjects performed moderate exercise during the exposures. The investigators made a number of pulmonary function measurements and used a procedure called bronchoscopy to collect fluids and tissue samples from the subjects' airways. They analyzed these samples for indicators of inflammation and lung damage.
Balmes separated subjects into two categories on the basis of how much their FEV1 response decreased after exposure to ozone: those least sensitive (smallest decrease) or most sensitive (greatest decrease) to ozone. The investigators addressed three issues: (1) Is an individual's reactivity to inhaled methacholine predictive of how his or her lung function would change after exposure to ozone? (2) What is the relation between ozone-induced airway inflammation (measured 18 hours after exposure) and changes in lung function (measured during and immediately after exposure)? and (3) Do the changes in lung function and markers of inflammation in response to ozone exposure differ between normal people and people with asthma?
Dr. Frampton's overall objectives were similar to those of the Balmes study, except that Dr. Frampton studied smokers as a potentially susceptible population. Because he was able to identify only a few smokers as sensitive to ozone (on the basis of their FEV1 responses), all smokers were grouped together for further study. Dr. Frampton measured pulmonary function and markers of inflammation immediately after air or ozone exposure and 18 hours later, thus allowing examination of the time course of these two responses in the same subject. The two investigator groups collaborated to compare the levels of three markers of airway inflammation among the normal, asthmatic, and smoker groups.
Summary/Accomplishments (Outputs/Outcomes):
These studies produced both confirmatory and new information about the responses of normal and potentially susceptible people to environmentally relevant concentrations of ozone. Both investigators confirmed findings from other laboratories. Namely, that exposure to ozone at levels that occur in ambient settings results in reversible changes in FEV1. Also, many people develop an inflammatory response in their airways (as determined by the appearance of markers of inflammation and cell injury in their lung fluids) after being exposed to ozone. Furthermore, they found no correlation among ozone-induced respiratory symptoms, changes in pulmonary function (as measured by FEV1), and markers of airway inflammation.
Both Balmes and Frampton found that a subject's airway responsiveness to methacholine did not correlate with the reduction in FEV1 observed after ozone exposure. Moreover, normal subjects who were characterized as being most sensitive or least sensitive to ozone (by measurements of FEV1) did not differ in their ozone-induced inflammatory responses. This implies that even if pulmonary function does not change, other potentially harmful effects of ozone, such as airway inflammation, may occur. Balmes found that breathing ozone caused similar changes in FEV1 in normal and asthmatic subjects. However, 18 hours after exposure to 0.02 ppm ozone for four hours, the levels of some markers of inflammation in lung fluids from asthmatic subjects were higher than the levels observed in normal subjects. Although this suggests that when people with asthma are exposed to ozone, they may develop more intense respiratory tract inflammation than healthy people, further studies are needed at multiple time points after exposure.
Dr. Frampton and colleagues found that although smokers have a greater degree of underlying airway inflammation than nonsmokers, they actually had smaller ozone-induced decrements in FEV1 than nonsmokers. The magnitude of the inflammatory response to ozone was similar in smokers and nonsmokers. It was also the same in subjects characterized as most sensitive and least sensitive to ozone on the basis of their FEV1 responses. The investigators found that some compounds (called cytokines) that are known to be important mediators of inflammation were present immediately after exposure to ozone. However, the overall inflammatory response was greater 18 hours after ozone exposure (when lung function had returned toward normal levels) than immediately after exposure.
An unexpected finding of the collaborative study was that the effects of the bronchoscopic procedures used to obtain the airway fluids and biopsy specimens may persist for many weeks in some subjects. This has critical implications for studies involving repeated invasive procedures.
The results of the studies reported here suggest that measuring symptoms and pulmonary function (using standard measurements of air flow) may not be sufficient to evaluate the potential risks associated with ozone exposure. Many individuals experience airway inflammation after being exposed to ozone, and this response is not reflected in the FEV1 response. The significance of ozone-induced inflammation in terms of subsequent airway disease has not been determined. More attention needs to be directed toward assessing the effects of ozone on small airway function and toward developing noninvasive measurements of airway inflammation.
expertwrote on 7/13/2009 9:21 am
to jdlphki
...thank you for caring enough about asthma facts to check them out. I appreciate it.
expertwrote on 7/13/2009 9:15 am
to jdlehkpi??? whatever
Keep reading you are getting there go to EPA, NEJM, ANAAA, CDC, WHO, websites.
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 9:04 am
So these quotes from the NDRC (National Resources Defense Council) are supposed to convince us? They say:
"Studies have shown..."
but they don't say which studies.
They tell us that:
"Around 81 million people live in areas that fail to meet national air quality standards for particulate matter."
but they don't bother to tell us which areas those are and precisely WHAT is causing the poor air quality.
They quite specifically don't tell us just HOW the addition of an Intermodal in Gardner is going to affect our city by telling us how much particulate pollution we can expect, how it will be dispersed over the area, etc.
Interestingly, the Army Corps of Engineers actually DID that study in its 404 Evaluation Assessment. Are they "ignorant" too, Expert, because they don't read NRDC's environmental website?
expertwrote on 7/13/2009 8:40 am
To those with Asthma or any airway disease or any one who thinks the increase in pollution wont effect their breathing
from the NRDC
•Particulate Matter: This term refers to a wide range of pollutants -- dust, soot, fly ash, diesel exhaust particles, wood smoke and sulfate aerosols -- which are suspended as tiny particles in the air. Some of these fine particles can become lodged in the lungs and could trigger asthma attacks. Studies have shown that the number of hospitalizations for asthma increases when levels of particulate matter in the air rise. Coal-fired power plants, factories and diesel vehicles are major sources of particulate pollution. Around 81 million people live in areas that fail to meet national air quality standards for particulate matter.
wrote on 7/13/2009 8:22 am
I am glad the fairy tell three love being in la la land. We will see how long that last...
wrote on 7/13/2009 8:05 am
A big thank you to Thompson, Peters and Shepherd! Keep up the good work for those who care about their community.
Expertwrote on 7/13/2009 8:02 am
To JDPHKI and CBP
First of all your ignorance floors me you dont have to be in the Medical field to know about the studies and facts on the effects of particulate matter on those sensitive and especially those with reactive ariway diesease. This is taken from the EPA's website out of an artical on outdoor air and asthma.
Small particles and ozone come from things like exhaust from cars and factories, smoke and road dust. When inhaled, outdoor pollutants can aggravate the lungs, and can lead to chest pain, coughing, shortness of breath and throat irritation. Outdoor air pollution may also worsen chronic respiratory diseases, such as asthma. On days when ozone air pollution is highest, ozone has been associated with 10-20% of all respiratory hospital visits and admissions.
Anyone with a brain knows most people with reactive airway disease have trouble with exhaust emissions so......since you and CBP are so ignorant to the facts on asthma and i think this will be my last post to either of you on the subject,this is like having a discussion with a brick wall, go educate yourself on the matter and then maybe we can have an educated discussion instead of this nonsensical one.
jdelphikiwrote on 7/13/2009 7:32 am
So Expert, what exactly are you an expert in again?
Your experience as a nurse who worked with an allergist probably DOES give you some extra knowledge about the workings of allergy shots, but you seem to expect us to believe that it ALSO makes you an expert in the environmental impact of the Intermodal. Did you spend ten years working at an intermodal as well? Or maybe you helped write the Army Corps of Engineers 404 Environmental Assessment.
Asthma is not something to be laughed at. It's a serious ailment that IS made worse by a wide variety of irritants and airborne triggers. My own asthma didn't kick in until I was an adult and the worst attacks I've had involved my running around in a hayfield. I don't recall ever having problems with an asthma attack from being around big trucks. Even the big, truck-filled shipping ports on the East Coast didn't cause me any grief.
I know that my own experience doesn't speak for all asthmatics and I don't presume to imply that it does. At the same time, I don't know that you're being entirely accurate when you tell us that the experiences of some of the worst cases of asthma will automatically apply to everyone in Gardner because of the Intermodal.
We DO get that diesel smoke is a pollutant and an irritant that can cause respitory problems, especially in those who are already sensitive to it. What we DON'T get, and what the folks who continue to preach doom and gloom about the Intermodal keep avoiding, are realistic, objective stats that show a correlation between high-concentration areas of diesel smoke (like, for instance, a truck stop) and increases in ailments for people who spend a lot of time there (like, truck stop workers).
Show us stats that illustrate how the people who live next to the tracks here in Gardner (and would thereby be consuming the smoke from 80 trains a day) have higher incidences of asthma than the rest of Gardner or the metro.
Show us something other than wild assumptions and you'll have a better time in selling your expert opinion.
Of course, we'll STILL have to deal with the Intermodal because it'll still be built.
Lindawrote on 7/13/2009 7:17 am
Yes, i did it was a report about the water, which was why i got on the subject. Water ahmm? Better be concerned about the air.
Argentine is/was an intermodal. It was BNSF's transcon main and the intermodal here will replace it and then we can all look forward to kooking, smelling, living and turning into the next Argentine railyard district. Lovely.
Expertwrote on 7/13/2009 6:58 am
To CPB
I am a 30 + yrs Registered Nurse and worked for an allergist for 10 years. You are in good shape today because you received those shots. Many people with Asthma/Allergies dont smell money when they inhale even tiny amounts of exhaust, they definatly can and many do have ariway inflammation and constriction from it and the worst of those a trip to the ER. An increase in exhaust fumes(and it wont be miniscule if an intermodal logistics park comes to your town or near it) in the area will have a direct and profound effect on those exhaust sensitive people and not just the people with airway sensitivity but also those with high blood pressure, migraines and the like. Be prepared.
CPBwrote on 7/13/2009 12:05 am
The Argentine District smells different because of the river.
CPBwrote on 7/12/2009 11:52 pm
The shots that I had for 11 years basically introduced my body to the items that I was allergic to so that my body learned how to deal with them. Just like people will get used to the minuscule extra amount of exhaust that the inter modal project will induce. I enjoy the smell of diesel fuel. It smells like $$$$. Did you even read the report from the Army Corps?
wrote on 7/12/2009 8:45 pm
why bother, seems you are only going to allow the continual debate between your chosen few and then only if it is in ragards to the Gardner city council. I wont bother with your website any more.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/12/2009 8:38 pm
The good thing about Mr. Hale is not even John and Dan could not deny he was a great nomination and could not deny his expertise was exceptional.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/12/2009 8:37 pm
The good thing about Mr. Hale is not even John and Dan could not deny he was a great nomination and could deny his expertise was exceptional.
wrote on 7/12/2009 8:01 pm
To me the bar was set about as low as it can go with Mr. Hale and all you have to do is read his words on his last article on this site and be familiar with his past words, actions and inaction. Mr. Drovetta most definitely appointed one of his own.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/12/2009 6:55 pm
The majority won't fell. Then we be able to see what the council looks like. Sure the Mayor will try to top his last appointment, yet I know that will be hard. Topping Mr.Hale will be a big chore...
wrote on 7/12/2009 6:46 pm
So you get a whole new council and it is a new ball game thus why the Allen Group heavily bankrolled three candidates for office. So glad the people voted for true representatives rather than paid ones for the Allen Group/BNSF. Sometimes integrity and ethics win out over the money mongers and this may well have been one of those instances.
Semanticswrote on 7/12/2009 6:33 pm
The agreements were approved by a vote of a properly seated council.
They weren't signed becuase the county piece wasn't finished yet and then BNSF delayed their project.
wrote on 7/12/2009 6:02 pm
Those agreements were not signed so they were not rescinded per se.
There is a difference between an intermodal and inland port also.
Heathwrote on 7/12/2009 3:53 pm
Actually, I have several dear friends in Stanley and learned a great deal about their fight against annexation. Some of whom served on the No Annexation committee where I helped them with some of their marketing materials and mailings. Much like Gardner, they were the majority, yet the Council chose to work against them in what was seen by many as a ahow of power. In Gardner, we had 2 newly elected officials flex their new political power by rescinding an already agreed upon proposal that had the support of the people. What's different...aside from which side you support?
Am I part of the problemwrote on 7/12/2009 3:47 pm
@333
I have just one question. Do you even know what an intermodal is? Explain to me what you think it is. Argentine is not just an intermodal, so your statement there is not correct.
wrote on 7/12/2009 3:38 pm
Heath: You don't even understand the issue of the Overland Park annexation or what I was saying evidently and I am sure not going to sit here and educate you.
Heathwrote on 7/12/2009 3:34 pm
To 12:30, I find it hilarious that you speak out against the JoCo Commission for disregarding the voice of the people when moving forward with the OP annexation. Is that not the exact same thing taking place in The City of Garnder, yet we are bafoons for expecting more from our elected officials on the City Council. Need I remind you that the public speakers at each of the last 2 Council meetings spoke in resounding support of the annexation. You say that you hope Watson puts the screws to them, does that mean you would support BNSF and TAG if they were to pursue a suit against the city? Seems like failed logic to me.
wrote on 7/12/2009 3:33 pm
Once again, MOVING is not an answer. Look at the Argentine area that is what we will see and SMELL and that is what our home prices will do too and that is also the kind of neighborhoods we will eventually have. We might not be a big town but our property is worth something and our air is cleaner than the inner city air and by sitting back with our heads in the sand acting like its not such a bad idea we are bending over and taking one in the behind. SOooo if soemone has some real answers and solutions to the problem we need to hear them. Then maybe if we all invested the amount of energy into the solution as we do into this stupid blog we could be part of the fix, please just dont say MOVE if you dont like it that is so lame
Am I part of the problem?wrote on 7/12/2009 3:16 pm
@306
Life is too short the way things are already. Anger/negativity will make your lifespan even shorter.
Did you ever think this intermodal facility may not be as bad as everyone is saying?
If you can't get past that, maybe you should consider doing something about how you feel and move. That is something you have full control over. If it brings you happiness, how can you put a price that?
wrote on 7/12/2009 3:06 pm
No, I am a very angry person with elected officials, BNSF, the Allen Group and other specials interests who will make my life miserable and charge me an arm and leg to do so. They took a very happy, content citizen who has always contributed to their community in so many ways and turned them into someone who longer trusts anything they say or do and that was brought on by their actions, not mine.
1:58wrote on 7/12/2009 2:34 pm
It is good that the city provides you something to complain about. Same tired old griping no offer to make things better just griping.
Cities need economic development whether you like it or not.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/12/2009 2:26 pm
Droveta, Winters, Hale, answered all emails, why not the other three? Didn't have good answers? Didn't like questions? wanted to continue secrecy?
Am I part f the problemwrote on 7/12/2009 2:08 pm
@146
What's the matter? I don't hear any answers coming from you. Tell me your solutions. Or would you have to repeat yourself by crying about pollution, poison air, or how you have to live near an intermodal.
It's coming, like it or not, why fight with the people trying to make a difference in our community.
Lindawrote on 7/12/2009 1:45 pm
I thought this post was for responses to the 404 public notice, how'd we get back on the tiring subject of the Gardner city council?
wrote on 7/12/2009 1:38 pm
I am personally tired of hearing the cop out statement of "Move if you dont like it" give an anwere to the solution or dont bother posting please its getting old. Moving is not a solution. And as far as people using no names some of us due to our jobs need to be more discret than others so get over that too an opinion is still an opinion.
wrote on 7/12/2009 1:30 pm
Paul Jones: Winters has never, never answered my e-mails, thanked me for info I have sent - nothing, nada, zero so don't put him up there with the liberty flag because he doesn't deserve it. And if you had a brain in your head you would realize why you got a reply from Winters.
wrote on 7/12/2009 1:23 pm
Bend a knee - you know exactly what I am talking about and you have had elected officials and many others bending the knee to BNSF and the Allen Group and others for years. But they sure haven't been bending the knee for the average citizen. You haven't seen many true public servants in this town until last April brought a few more on board much to the dismay of the money and greed mongers.
You must have very little respect for Peters, Thompson and Shepherd to think they cannot think for themselves and make their own decisions - they are not influenced by what Fotovich had to say but I do feel they may have very much agreed with what he had to say but there again they can speak for themselves. Fotovich is the not the mayor of Gardner - he does not owe you or any other citizen a thing or have to stay here and listen to people like you and take your crud - if he wants to move I can truly understand why he would want something better for his family.
Am I part of the problem?wrote on 7/12/2009 12:46 pm
@ comment made at 1230 - "Bend a knee to them" - What are you talking about? Are you serious?
Blame Fotovich? He is the one that influenced the current council majority in their vote, and now he is leaving. He helped create the current situation the city is in and now is jumping ship. Transparency in government? His actions are going to let people see right through him.
If he is so concerned about the welfare of Gardner why is he leaving? Just last April this town was good enough for him to want to be mayor for a term. Common - let's take back Gardner.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/12/2009 12:26 pm
Lets all remember, we can email Mr. Winters on the progress of new talks regarding the Inter-modal project...He answered all my many emails,good and bad ones, unlike Mr. Shepard. (answered "O")
Concerned Gardner Citizenwrote on 7/12/2009 12:18 pm
@ The environmental/health impact
You wrote:
"If the intermodal is coming and we can't stop it, vigilance by the local citizens will be necessary. If we aren't vigilant and don't continue to hold BNSF and TAG accountable someday we'll get a visit from Erin Brockovich.
Businesses will try to operate as lean as possible, and ignoring the enviroment is less expensive than being responsible. Handling and helping dispose of hazardous materials is big business, profitable business.
Should Gardner successfully annex the property, and work in concert with BNSF/TAG it is the RESPONSIBILTY of the Mayor, City Council, and City Administrators to be vigilant and ensure the health and welfare of our citizens."
That's part of the reason why de-annexing the land is such a huge mistake.
The environmental/health impact ...wrote on 7/12/2009 10:52 am
If the intermodal is coming and we can't stop it, vigilance by the local citizens will be necessary. If we aren't vigilant and don't continue to hold BNSF and TAG accountable someday we'll get a visit from Erin Brockovich.
Businesses will try to operate as lean as possible, and ignoring the enviroment is less expensive than being responsible. Handling and helping dispose of hazardous materials is big business, profitable business.
Should Gardner successfully annex the property, and work in concert with BNSF/TAG it is the RESPONSIBILTY of the Mayor, City Council, and City Administrators to be vigilant and ensure the health and welfare of our citizens.
To think otherwise, "Concerned Gardner Resident", shows a lack of respect for all citizens of Gardner
wrote on 7/12/2009 10:36 am
Concerned Gardner Citizen: Your train of thought is exactly what the old status quo and many still want. They want to turn their heads from the environmental concerns and really don't care about suffering of the people (look how posters on this site made fun of Mrs. Peters for wanting to bring in an expert with respect to environmental concerns and then you have the Solies talk about being respectable and civil - this site doesn't know the definition or practice the meaning of those words), they see the project only with the dollar bill in mind and those dollars will only be seen by the few, they want only to take care of the special interests and they continue to sell the fairy tale that the project can be managed and controlled. You have been controlled for the past 4 years and you still don't recognize it or want to. We need a new and ongoing Declaration of Independence wherein the people decide what is best for their community and not by the likes of Lehman, Drovetta, city administration, Jo. Co. Commissioners and other elected officials who cater to and enable the special interests to exploit our people. They are governing for those who constantly are in your halls of government with their hands out and giving the people the thumbed nose and the hand gesture. You have these people to thank for this killing project and you, too, are all so willing to get on the band wagon.
Well, just remember there are those who disagree with you entirely and are not ready to just roll over and say make the best of it - there is no making the best of it - best just doesn't even enter the picture.
Concerned Gardner Citizenwrote on 7/12/2009 10:10 am
Why debate the environmental/health impact of this intermodal? Will continuing to debate the environmental impact make the intermodal go elsewhere? No.
Will the intermodal have less of an impact on the citizens of Gardner if it's part of Edgerton, or Johnson County? No.
If you believe the intermodal is coming (whether we like it or not) the only issue worthy of debate is should it be part of Gardner, or not.
If you still think we can make the intermodal go away, you're not looking at the facts surrounding this project objectively.
Is it POSSIBLE that the intermodal will go away? Sure, anything's possible. Is it PROBABLE that the intermodal will go away? No.
If you're managing a City government and focusing on possibilities while ignoring probabilities, you're not performing your duties in the best interest of your constituents.
As a for instance: If you liquidate your retirement plan and use the proceeds to buy Powerball tickets, it's possible that you could retire much wealthier. But, it's not probable.
If you wouldn't manage your future by acting upon possibilities rather than probabilities, why would you let your City Council manage your City's future that way?
wrote on 7/12/2009 9:01 am
Man is slowly asphyxiating himself. Makes me think of the old movie Soylent Green, Guess I can be like the majority and keep my head in the sand.
Todaywrote on 7/12/2009 7:17 am
What about all the emmissions today? Trains roll through town now, trucks on the highway now, tractors working the farms now, school buses running now, trucks delivering to New Century now. There are regs that went into effect in 2007 that will continue to make diesel cleaner.
Particulate matter is not just a part of diesel, its in auto exhaust, lawn mower exhaust, field burning, dust from unpaved roads, fire places, barbeque grills, anything where there is combustion.......
Asthmatic....wrote on 7/11/2009 9:59 pm
To Paul Jones, you need to educate yourself from an expert, not someone who is ignorant and who obviously doesnt have problems anymore(probaby because they got DESNSITIZED with shots for 11 years). Oh, and CBP if you lived on a farm, you would probably be bothered by something around there like the hay or grass (no not that.... that was probably one of the ingredients in your allergy shots as a kid, amen to your Mother who made you get those shots or you would probably be choking on something still)since it sounds like at one time you WERE prone to airway irritation, you may get used to any farm things that may bother you, only to exchange it for another irritant that wasnt in your 11 YEARS worth of allergy shots.... like exhaust fumes
Linda Gwrote on 7/11/2009 9:25 pm
To CBP
Uhh duh, did you ever think your 11 years of shots is probably why your asthma or allergies dont bother you today and maybe your are not sensitive to exhaust fumes? Most people with Asthma, even those well controlled by using anti inflammatories/bronchodilators (like myself)and even those who had shots still are bothered by exhaust, still feel the burn after being behind those vehicals. Given your medical history, you will more than likely have problems on some level eventually and when you do good luck convincing yourself that you have risen above it since you seem to think you are mighty enough to "will it" away. And myfriend I hope for you that vehical exhaust doesnt bother you or your fresh air will feel like poison to you.
Edgerton Galwrote on 7/11/2009 9:08 pm
To Linda G. and wrote on: We have caring hearts and souls only to be slammed by the people who have been "duped" into thinking that there will be millions and millions of dollars coming our way from the BNSF project and flip our health off. The only thing left I guess is to cling to our Bibles and faith and consult with the American Lung Association and Hospice (end of life care) for support. (I awakened on July 5th after the big 4th of July fumes in my house hoarse and with congestion; recovered somewhat by today only to be exposed again trying to clean up the yard.)
wrote on 7/11/2009 8:41 pm
To Edgerton Gal.... I hear ya sister, its a shame and its just going to keep on and keep on until there isnt anymore ",clean fresh country air" to breath. I guess mankind is really going to cause his own extinction he will asphyxiate eventually.
Lindawrote on 7/11/2009 8:33 pm
To CBP:
Not using asthma as an excuse. (I workout doing 6 hrs of cardio a week although the only reason this is possible is because of an inhaled anti inflammatory, advair 500, twice a day) There are no shots for diesel fume sensitivity and no you do not get used to it or I would have grown accustomed to it 40 years ago when i was just starting to choke on it, its very irritating. I remember as a kid growing up on Brookside in Kansas city, living on a street (Wornall rd) where city buses and various traffic ran all day (By the way I didnt have asthma then but did notice how exhaust fumes burnt my nose and lungs and eyes and just all together stunk) Anyway, I remember thinking when I grow up Im living in the country where the air smells good and clean and there isnt a ton of noisy stinky traffic that never stops (day or night). So here I am 46 and getting ready for the non stop stinky traffic I finally had gotten mostly away from and im thinking what poor kid who thinks the trucks stink is really gonna get blasted half his life with fumes, move away from it only to develope Asthma later down the road. Im the first person who you wont see letting asthma or allergies be an excuse or a crutch. Asthma is very real, if you had it or allergies to any degree you would know this. In my last post,the point I was trying to make was, diesel is very irritating and probably more toxic then we realize, I know our country depends on transportation in this fashion so moving away would not be an answere because it would just follow you. I know trying to fight for clean air anywhere in our country would be fruitless but I guarentee you the exhaust will bother people sensitive to it and exacerbate their symptoms and probably be the direct cause of someones future problem with asthma and you know what? It will probably some little kid who thinks when they grow up they are moving away from the noise and the stink just like i USED to and we can all Thank BNSF for adding some more killer air to our clean country air.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/11/2009 7:33 pm
By the way no name it is when it is built, not if. IF, is gone...
Paul Joneswrote on 7/11/2009 7:31 pm
No name please let me know when your home is on the market, so I can see about one of my daughters would be interested.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/11/2009 7:28 pm
You might check it out for the past 10 years,then we will have something to compare to. Thanks for the concern though. To bad we could not have a few more city council members hadnt remembered we would still have to spend our tax dollars on road repairs ect., yet we could of gotten some tax dollars off the project, down the road for studys and repairs down the road...
wrote on 7/11/2009 7:25 pm
I would encourage every homeowner to put their home on the market. If the intermodal comes, you will not want to live here, that is, if you want any quality of life whatsoever. If you want to live in an industrial setting and want your health adversely affected and don't mind dodging millions of trucks, then definitely stay and maybe you can be a slum lord.
gardner citizenwrote on 7/11/2009 7:13 pm
Looks like BNSF got exactly what they wanted no suprise. Now all they need is to steal taxpayer money to build infrastructure and help pay for the project that supposidly is not going to cause enviromental impacts. Lets see how many times this area of the county has a red ozone day when this thing gets built. Not sure where they nearest sensor in this are is that checks this.
Paul Joneswrote on 7/11/2009 6:38 pm
Thanks CPB! I don't have asthma, so I really learned something from your comments.
CPBwrote on 7/11/2009 6:24 pm
Asthma and allergies are not a good excuse. I've had asthma my whole life. I had allergy shots from 5 years old till I decided that I didn't want them anymore at age 16. My body has become accustomed to the world that I live in and I rarely have any more problems. The only thing that really bothers me is Hay. I'm sure that if I lived on a farm for a few years my body would become accustomed to it as well. Also, it was worse when I was in bad shape. You can use asthma as an excuse, and you may get some sympathy from those that don't have it. For those that have it and choose to deal with it though, it is annoying to hear it used as an excuse. The inter modal is on it's way. If you don't like it, put your house up for sale.
Yeswrote on 7/11/2009 2:05 pm
We keep it up and Gardner will be part of Olathe soon...or Egderton.
Olathewrote on 7/11/2009 1:44 pm
Did anyone notice that the proposed "Olathe" site was really in Gardner?
Paul Joneswrote on 7/10/2009 7:53 pm
It is a free world, if you cant find something good about Gardner then why say anything. The serenity prayer might help you, it does me...
Linda G.wrote on 7/10/2009 7:35 pm
Tell that to someone with Asthma and Allergies. Truck and train emissions will have a sigificant effect on them. People with asthma who are sensitive to exhaust fumes (most are)very often have immediate symptoms(coughing, wheezing and or shortness of breath) after being near some vehicles exhaust and especially after riding behind one on the road. In addition to the initial symtoms you then feel like you have a head and chest cold for a day or two. According to the CDC, roughly 8-10% of the nation has Asthma that means there will be close to two thousand people(thats close to the size of Edgertons entire population) with an increase in breathing difficulties. I being a person with Asthma and Allergies thinks the increase in truck traffic will have not only an impact but a significant impact of my health and well being. Thanks BNSF for polluting my air more than it already is
AGRwrote on 7/10/2009 6:14 pm
This looks like some good reading...
Concerned Gardner Citizenwrote on 7/10/2009 5:57 pm
Raise your hand if you still think the intermodal is going away.
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wrote on 7/22/2009 11:44 am
go to www.gardnerkansas.gov click on city government, city council and mayor e-mails are in the contact information at the top of the page
retired wrote on 7/22/2009 11:07 am
Does anyone have the email addresses for the city adminstrator, mayor,and council members? I can not find them on the city website. thank you
Outsidelookingin wrote on 7/21/2009 1:05 pm
I have no problem educating myself, I have significantly educated myself so far. I have been researching this issue for the last 3 years. While some might do research to defend their position, I do research that encompasses the entire picture. If you have specific info on police and fire calls at elwood then please supply the link/contact info so I can verify for myself. I would like to determine for myself what "the majority" of calls means. I have a problem with terms like - "the majority of", "most of", "alot", "some of", "everybody".... These terms do not actually reflect research. A statement as a certain percentage of overall calls would reflect research. I would expect overall calls to increase if a large development was dropped into a relatively small developed area.
Please provide studies/research that contradict the studies supplied in the Corps Draft EA and I will study those as well. Please do not continue to reference studies that were done by agencies that ONLY considered California. While I will 110% agree that pollution is a serious issue, I also believe that our government(Federal, State, Local) will enforce all applicable laws relative to any industrial operation. I have no other choice.
If you were to read the Corp's Draft EA you would find that ALL applicable federal and state agencies have done studies that concluded that there will be no or minor adverse environmental impact from the KC logistic park and intermodal development. Similair effects were determined for the "no action alternative". You would also find that the ONLY potential pollution issue with the development is post-construction fugitive dust emissions. This is the same thing generated by gravel roads and farming. The developing parties will be required to moniter this and mitigate as necessary to meet air quality standards.
Since I live 400 yards from the SE corner of the development, you should understand that I am SIGNIFICANTLY intersted in the impacts. So please do not assume that I am not doing my homework. I would invite ALL to study(educate yourself) the Crop's Draft EA and the associated doucments. There may be info there that will assist in defending one's position, then again enlightenment(educate yourself) might be to much to seek.
wrote on 7/20/2009 9:27 pm
Outsidelookingin: You might want to read Elwood police and fire department calls since the majority of them are for the Elwood intermodal and educate yourself or is that asking too much?
Outsidelookingin wrote on 7/20/2009 11:38 am
Interesting that the videos did not show thick black clouds of diesel smoke, illegial alliens hopping off trains, hookers on street corners, terrorists with weapons of mass destruction, barren land caused by toxic/fuel spills, or crumbling roads.
If you are willing to do without the items that we purchase everyday then we would not need to have such facilities. If citizens would be willing to give up their current lifestyles and become totally self sufficiant then we would not require the big distribution systems that we relay on to bring us the "STUFF" that we can not seem to live without.
wrote on 7/19/2009 4:06 pm
You want truckers and trucks - here is what you are dying to get. Real quality of life.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QwhguThPtag
wrote on 7/19/2009 8:52 am
Here is what awaits you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf63d7h2k3E
wrote on 7/18/2009 6:59 pm
Real World
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6u4vB_JoCg&feature=related
wrote on 7/18/2009 2:01 pm
Welcome to Utopia
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EvfCr4hI6K0
Outsidelookingin wrote on 7/18/2009 1:44 pm
'The People" have their EI study in the Corp's Draft Environmental Assessment which is the main part of the 404 permit evaluation. The Draft EA includes a section "Affected Environment and Environmental Consequences" that addresses land usr, air quality, noise & vibration, socioenomic conditions, community & recreational resources, roadways & traffic, geology & soils, prime farmland, water resources, vegetation & wildlife, threatened & endangered species, cultural resources, visual & aesthetic conditions, hazardous materials, rail safety and utilities.
The Draft EA was prepared with cooperation from various state and federal agencies with their extensive imput. Each segment of the environmantal evaluation was completed with an associated study which is also part of the Draft EA as appendix attachments.
Everyone might want to read the documents so they will have the facts to defend their respective positions.
Avis wrote on 7/18/2009 1:00 pm
'Anonymous' would like you to view the video links they posted on the Edgerton budget story.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/17/2009 6:15 pm
Thanks for the input
wrote on 7/17/2009 5:30 pm
Paul: I'm guessing the group is quiet on purpose. If the Army Corps Eng or EPA wouldn't allow intermodal then they wouldn't have to sue. If the economy was too weak to build, there is nothing to fight. Why play your cards until you need to? Just keep throwing up hurdles one by one as needed to drag this out and keep your oponents guessing. If you come off too strong, the opposition will mobilize. Sneaky and slow works. Look how successful they were with the election. People thought that the intermodal annexation was a done deal. The new council might be tougher to deal with on the details, which might be a good thing, but we assumed that Gardner was already committed to the annexation and agreements. Surprise!
Paul Jones wrote on 7/17/2009 5:13 pm
Why has this group been so quite? Nothing to stand on or what? If they had so much proof why keep it a secret.. When I believe something I speak out. Like many other citizens.
wrote on 7/17/2009 3:16 pm
Again, the people need a full environmental impact study done before the inland port/intermodal should even be considered - that needs to be done now and not later.
wrote on 7/17/2009 1:41 pm
ooops, typo. That's diesel "plume" not "plum".
wrote on 7/17/2009 1:33 pm
Correction: according to article, HELP stands for Hillsdale Environmental Loss Protection.
Of course, except for spokesman "Gardner resident Bryan DeMars" none of the "200 members" are named.
According to the article DeMars said the stakes are too high to ignore. He believes the facility will create a diesel plum that could drift toward local structures such as Gardner-Edgerton High School and be deposited on nearby ground. "This will kill everybody. This will shorten everybody's life within five years." It would be interesting to interview DeMars to get the full story in context, instead of just these sound bites.
wrote on 7/17/2009 9:58 am
how can we find out who the members are in the HELP group. public record or not?
wrote on 7/16/2009 9:33 pm
These pushback lawsuits may be the cornerstone of Councilwoman Peter's faith that intermodal will not come.
wrote on 7/16/2009 6:31 pm
Bryan DeMars and the Hillsdale Environmental Group (HELP) are mentioned in the lead story of the Gardner News (7/15). You have to be a subscriber to the online version of the paper to see the whole story, or buy a paper at a newstand now. (The new paper will be on newstands on Friday, replacing this one.) Looks like the HELP group wants to file a lawsuit against the Army Corp on Aug. 1, the day that the public comment period ends. According to the article, those involved with HELP say that the intermodal will have long term effects on the environment and that similar projects in California and Oregaon have had problems with diesel spills, air pollution and increased traffic. The article goes on with quotes from DeMars and Councilman Hale.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/16/2009 5:19 pm
Thank you very much
wrote on 7/16/2009 5:15 pm
there was this from last year....
http://www.scribd.com/doc/1029512/Bryan-DeMars-on-the-proposed-BNSF-Intermodal-Rail-Yard-near-Gardner-Kansas
Is there something else?
Paul Jones wrote on 7/16/2009 4:20 pm
Does anyone know Bryan DeMars, with the HELP group, 200 people plus him, talking about some cloud over High School,or something like that, quoted in that Gardner paper thing...
wrote on 7/15/2009 8:03 am
Edgerton: I give you the project with great joy and my humble gratitude to some Council members who ACTUALLY govern for the people and not the big boys - wondered if I ever would see the day, especially since the old status quo has about ripped every dollar I have in my pocket and had big plans to get the last one left.
HEHE wrote on 7/15/2009 7:11 am
Way to go Edgerton, Thanks Gardner!!
wrote on 7/13/2009 9:53 pm
One thing I got out of the council workshop is the new Coleman plant will be giving our Parks over 100000 a year....
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 9:33 pm
Would you post the comments of a business person who supports the Intermodal?
My question is this: what the heck does the questionable need of the stimulus money have to do with whether or not the Intermodal is built (which it's going to be anyway) or whether or not the Intermodal is going to kill us with its diesel fumes?
If we want to debate the necessity of the stimulus or where the Congress and the current administration send the money, that's a great discussion. But it's not relevant to what we've been discussing, ad nauseum, about our own Intermodal and city government concerns.
Actually, like your business person, I smell a LOT of rats tied to the stimulus money. But while being a business person who works in both the US and Canada and who doesn't like stimulus money is impressive, the opinion of said business person in our discussion carries pretty much the same weight as anyone else who chooses to offer their opinions on the topics. Maybe it carries slightly more weight because of the person being in business, but maybe it carries less because the person doesn't necessarily live here (you didn't tell us one way or the other) and because the person him or herself as a "Political Moderate" before chiming in with his or her opinion.
The net result is that the business person's opinion carries the same value as anyone else. Do you feel it should carry more?
wrote on 7/13/2009 7:54 pm
"The earth provides enough for all of man's needs but not enough for all of man's greed" - Ghandi
wrote on 7/13/2009 6:01 pm
don't worry has defently sucked on to many tailpipes, don't loose any sleep over it , I would not of had that much patiance. good job
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 5:48 pm
"No credibility", huh?
At least you consistently fall back to insults and seeing demon motivations behind, not only those who disagree with you, but also behind those who would dare to offer you a truce.
What ARE you afraid of? When have I attacked anything but your own statements, insults, and what I perceived (in my opinion) to be your illogic? Did you see me making fun of you ailment by suggesting that you were "sucking tailpipes"? Did you see me calling you a liar or making up out of thin air what -I- felt your motivations were?
When have I done anything more nefarious than question the bile that you've dumped on people? Am I THAT evil for daring to disagree with you?
Ah well. It was a stretch for me to assume that you might accept any profferred olive branch or that you would would even consider holding yourself to a standard that whereupon you might constrain yourself from treating people like trash.
To everyone else, I apologize for my lengthy rant here. I should've known better. At least I tried, though.
wrote on 7/13/2009 5:26 pm
Jdel: You have shown your true colors too many times in the past on this site for anyone to fall for this ploy of yours - you have no credibility. People will not waste their time or efforts with you.
**********
With respect to another matter I have read comments on this site telling how the Legends and the race track have brought such wonderful times to taxpayers in Wyandotte Co. I would encourage anyone to compare property and personal property taxes on a $200,000 home and 2008 Ford 150 pickup in Wyandotte and Johnson County and see what you get. Just a few moments ago the local news headline was that the Wyandotte Co. Unified government is facing the biggest budget problems EVER. Property taxes are down and delinquent property taxes have greatly increased. So having a race track, the Lengends or an inland port/intermodal will not solve the tax and budget problems and I believe the facts would show these projects just add to the people's financial problems but the politicians and the special interests sure don't sell that truth.
So citizens study the issues carefully, do extensive research and educate yourselves - utopia is not handed to you and never will be - anything worthwhile is earned thru hard work, patience and realizing that politicians normally are selling you something that is too good to be true just like the scam artists and even go so far sometimes of overlooking or turning their heads from many adverse affects to the people.
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 4:05 pm
And there you have why you don't find many supporters out here (or apparently in Gardner).
When people offer you sympathy or even the smallest portion of acknowledgement of the positions you support, you insult them and call them liars.
At any rate, despite everything else, I truly AM sorry that you are afflicted with such severe respitory problems. In the name of civility, I once again offer an olive branch to you so that we can argue the issues at hand instead of taking the discussion to the point where it's all insults and name-calling. I would hope that you would take me up on it and hold me, others, and yourself to that standard.
Then again, I've seen enough of your posts to suspect that my offer will, once again, be rebuffed. Maybe it is easier to think that the rest of the world really IS against you - because even when it's not, you seem to try that much harder to make it work out that way.
Ouch wrote on 7/13/2009 3:56 pm
What do you think is more hazardous to your health, sucking on the tail pipe of a truck or stressing about the destruction of the good people of Gardner night and day? Toss up...
wrote on 7/13/2009 2:55 pm
Jdel: I have seen too many of your postings to think for a minute you sypathize or give a rat's --- about someone who could suffer from the pollution the inland port would bring to our people. Go find some other suckers.
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 2:30 pm
1:59 - First, let me say that you have my sincere sympathy for the suffering your asthma/breathing problems cause you. Mine are fortunately mild most of the time, but I know how difficult they can be, especially for someone who is sensitive enough to have an asthma attack triggered by even incidental contact with smoke.
Knowing that you, yourself, suffer from respitory problems helps us to understand some of the vehemence with which you post on the subject.
That said, I'm not sure we can find a way to suit, both the inevitable growth of Gardner as the metro swallows us (like it has so many other suburbs), and the needs of people for whom the hazards of urban living represent a challenge and threat to their health.
In short, should Gardner simply turn away businesses that cater to, or use, diesel trucks in order to preserve some small portion of our airspace for the citizens who are most sensitive to pollution?
Say we somehow block the Intermodal and end up, instead, building a big box store of some kind on the land. Or a mall. Or maybe even the Lowe's that they were going to build elsewhere. Would the diesel smoke levels coming from the trucks needed to support one of those types of facilities be low enough to make life easier for you? What if that wasn't enough for you or for one of our other citizens? What ELSE would we have to omit from our city?
And even if we COULD prevent all that from happening inside Gardner, what about the pollution that comes from OUTSIDE our borders (and for the sake of my argument here, I won't use "Edgerton's Intermodal" as an example. But what IF the county or other municipalities eventually build up pollution-producing industries or businesses that bring in a lot of trucks and/or trains? How do we control that to preserve/prevent the pollution from affecting our most sensitive citizens?
I'm really NOT trying to be clever here. At some point, the metro WILL swallow up Garder and our ability to preserve the rural community that Gardner USED to be will evaporate. While we can do our part to make sure we don't invite in businesses that will prematurely end our rural identity, we ALSO need to be realistic about keeping control over the things that we CAN control when the businesses are going to come to our area anyway.
As for your health, I reiterate my sympathies to you. I, of course, can't speak for you, but if I was faced with a threat to my overall health because of the encroaching metro, I might look to moving to an area where I could live more safely.
BTW wrote on 7/13/2009 2:22 pm
And by the way, the Intermodal Facility is still coming.
Intermodal wrote on 7/13/2009 2:14 pm
For being so much against the intermodal I find it interesting that you would want to be driving out around the facility to get stuck behind one of those trucks.
And no, I don't believe they are going to be driving up and down main street or parking themselves in front of the Dolphin Song. I can't hardly stand driving up and down main street myself with everyone stopping to turn and hitting all the red lights with no green arrows.
wrote on 7/13/2009 1:59 pm
Are you serious what are ya gonna do hold your breath, you think there has to be a cloud of dust or smog for your lungs to feel the effects? No the Air in general will contain more particulate matter from emissions, these are things people like me (sensitive to diesel exhaust)FEEL in their lungs shortly after getting behind one of them and having it come in my car vents, and one can never escape it completely which is why I will probably never be able to quit taking inhaled anti inflammatories/ bronchodilators daily. What starts as a tickle, is followed by a burn then wheezing and then congestion the next few days. And sometimes an instant headache, Not plesant and Im not looking forward to having to breath it more. Sorry any good reason to have a big new business come to town will never be worth that to me or my lungs
The wind never stops blowing in Kansas wrote on 7/13/2009 1:44 pm
What happens to the fumes and exhaust when the wind blows? Does it not move or dissipate or does it just immediately settle into our chests?
I remember back in 2006 when we met in the high school to talk about the Intermodal coming and John Q Public, (Claude Hobby) talked about the cloud of pollution that would settle of the high school.
My first thought was. The wind never stops blowing in Kansas is that possible? And then I thought, are there other clouds of pollution stalking the population somewhere and if there are why haven't we seen them on the news or are they like UFO's or something?
wrote on 7/13/2009 1:30 pm
I know that a sprawling freight distribution complex is about to be plopped down in the middle of our towns and we will have more irritating fumes to breath in. And if you can honestly find me someone who thinks the traffic and the fumes will just be peachy. I'll dance you a jig!
Am I part of the problem? wrote on 7/13/2009 12:53 pm
@Linda
You love to compare Argentine to Gardner, yet your comparison is like apples to oranges.
I asked if anyone knew what the intermodal was, and you spewed Argentine.
Argentine is an intermodal PLUS a hump classification yard, PLUS a locomotive service facility, PLUS fuel islands to refuel through trains.
Your comparing Argentine to Gardner is a stretch at best.
Why don't you do your homework before you pretend to know what you are talking about.
Heinz wrote on 7/13/2009 11:03 am
No Name, have you ever watched the "Conspiracy Theory?"
Heath wrote on 7/13/2009 10:50 am
From the online edition of The Encyclopedia Britannica's entry on Special Interest Groups:
any association of individuals or organizations, usually formally organized, that, on the basis of one or more shared concerns, attempts to influence public policy in its favour. All interest groups share a desire to affect government policy to benefit themselves or their causes. Their goal could be a policy that exclusively benefits group members or one segment of society (e.g., government subsidies for farmers) or a policy that advances a broader public purpose (e.g., improving air quality). They attempt to achieve their goals by lobbying—that is, by attempting to bring pressure to bear on policy makers to gain policy outcomes in their favour.
All sides in this argument are Special Interest Groups, including BNSF, TAG, TAKE BACK GARDNER, etc. etc. So no name, you need to realize that you are part of your own Special Interest Group, competing against another.
wrote on 7/13/2009 10:41 am
Heintz: Sorry you haven't figured that out yet.
Heinz wrote on 7/13/2009 10:17 am
I would love to know who the special interest groups are, or at least who you think they are.
wrote on 7/13/2009 10:04 am
So glad the majority of the voters within Gardner, Ks. gave us representatives who could not be bought and paid for by the special interests. Gives you hope for tomorrow and lets you know the people know what has been going on now for numerous years and wants no part of it.
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 9:56 am
One more time...
You've illustrated with your lengthy EPA study that, yes, pollution can cause problems. You haven't shown us how much pollution we expect to get in Gardner from the Intermodal.
IS the Intemodal going to create smog in Gardner all by itself? Did the studies you cited on ozone mention where they were being taken? Was it in KC or in an area like Los Angeles (keeping in mind that LA gets a lot of its smog because of its unique geography, sandwiched between the ocean and a mountain range that traps pollutants more effectively than in many cities)?
We KNOW that pollution is bad. But when you try to take all the worst info of the worst pollution and concentrate it onto a single intermodal hub in Gardner, you stretch your credulity quite a bit.
(And next time, you might just give us a link to your sources instead of copy-and-paste. We can follow links and read them for ourselves).
Heinz wrote on 7/13/2009 9:47 am
Does that mean we can sue trucking companies for all the deaths their exhaust causes. People sued big tabacco right? In that case the sky is the limit.
All the doom and gloom around here is depressing.
Oh yeah, the Intermodal is still coming BTW.
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 9:44 am
The point I'm making here is that if we only read "evidence" that we agree with, we're not really giving ourselves a good view of the whole picture. Did you notice that I used the 404 EA as an example of an air particulate study when it is, instead, a wastewater assessment? Anyone can use (or misuse) facts to make them sound like what they want.
What I'm trying to get at is the whole picture, not pieces of it. So I WANT to hear about the damage we can expect from the Intermodal, even though I've been arguing for it out here. Seem inconsistent? Not for someone who wants to look at the problem as objectively as possible.
It's not inconsistent of me to acknowledge that pollution is a problem, but to also question your apparent claims that the Intermodal is going to turn Gardner into smog-filled Los Angeles. Or even the massively industrial Argentine district. It's not inconsistent to note that diesel particulates can cause airway distress for people sensitive to them, but to ALSO note that diesel particulates aren't the only pollutant, or asthma irritant, that we find in the air. It's not inconsistent that I believe we ought to do what we can to minimize the pollution we're going to get WHEN they build the Intermodal in Gardner, but also that I question the so-called experts who keep trying to tell us that we're all going to die because of it -- especially when those experts can't seem to dig up any objective causality info.
Like a lot of us here in Gardner, I'm TRYING to keep my mind open and look at all sides of the issue. Using hand-picked facts to try to paint a single side of the issue doesn't help us address the problems we face.
Scientific study FROM THE EPA wrote on 7/13/2009 9:38 am
just one of the study findings from the EPA on
Effects of Ozone on Pulmonary Function and Airway Inflammation in Normal and Potentially Sensitive Human Subjects
Objective:
Ozone is a common air pollutant and a major component of smog. The current National Ambient Air Quality Standard (which is currently being revised) is 0.12 parts per million (ppm), a level not to be exceeded for more than one hour, once per year. This standard is based largely on evidence that, in sensitive individuals, short-term exposure to ozone causes symptoms such as cough and shortness of breath, and reversible changes in some tests of lung function.
A procedure called spirometry is commonly used to measure lung function, particularly the measurement of forced expiratory volume in one second (FEV1), which is the volume of air a subject can forcibly exhale in the first second following maximal inhalation. Exposure to ozone causes a transient decrease in FEV1 in many people. This response is highly reproducible within an individual; however, there are marked differences among individuals in their sensitivities to ozone. Ozone also can cause the airways to become hyperresponsive to inhaled substances (such as the drug methacholine) that constrict the large airways or bronchi; this response is reflected in the airways becoming increasingly resistant to air flow. Finally, inhaling ozone can produce airway inflammation and cell injury, as evidenced by the appearance of cellular and biochemical markers of these reactions in airway fluids.
This report describes the results of two independent studies that were designed to (1) evaluate the range of ozone-induced responses in the general population, (2) study the effects of short-term exposure to ozone in populations with underlying airway inflammation (smokers and people with asthma), and (3) compare the responses in sensitive populations with those in normal subjects. A common goal of both studies was to characterize ozone-induced responses in populations thought to be most sensitive to ozone so that appropriate standards can be set to protect human health.
The studies described in this report were conducted by two investigator groups: Dr. John Balmes and colleagues of the University of California, San Francisco, and Dr. Mark Frampton and associates of the University of Rochester. Drs. Balmes and Frampton used similar ozone exposure regimens but different study populations: normal and asthmatic men and women exposed to 0.2 ppm ozone or clean air for four hours in the Balmes study, and male and female nonsmokers and smokers exposed to 0.22 ppm ozone or clean air for four hours in the Frampton study. In both studies subjects performed moderate exercise during the exposures. The investigators made a number of pulmonary function measurements and used a procedure called bronchoscopy to collect fluids and tissue samples from the subjects' airways. They analyzed these samples for indicators of inflammation and lung damage.
Balmes separated subjects into two categories on the basis of how much their FEV1 response decreased after exposure to ozone: those least sensitive (smallest decrease) or most sensitive (greatest decrease) to ozone. The investigators addressed three issues: (1) Is an individual's reactivity to inhaled methacholine predictive of how his or her lung function would change after exposure to ozone? (2) What is the relation between ozone-induced airway inflammation (measured 18 hours after exposure) and changes in lung function (measured during and immediately after exposure)? and (3) Do the changes in lung function and markers of inflammation in response to ozone exposure differ between normal people and people with asthma?
Dr. Frampton's overall objectives were similar to those of the Balmes study, except that Dr. Frampton studied smokers as a potentially susceptible population. Because he was able to identify only a few smokers as sensitive to ozone (on the basis of their FEV1 responses), all smokers were grouped together for further study. Dr. Frampton measured pulmonary function and markers of inflammation immediately after air or ozone exposure and 18 hours later, thus allowing examination of the time course of these two responses in the same subject. The two investigator groups collaborated to compare the levels of three markers of airway inflammation among the normal, asthmatic, and smoker groups.
Summary/Accomplishments (Outputs/Outcomes):
These studies produced both confirmatory and new information about the responses of normal and potentially susceptible people to environmentally relevant concentrations of ozone. Both investigators confirmed findings from other laboratories. Namely, that exposure to ozone at levels that occur in ambient settings results in reversible changes in FEV1. Also, many people develop an inflammatory response in their airways (as determined by the appearance of markers of inflammation and cell injury in their lung fluids) after being exposed to ozone. Furthermore, they found no correlation among ozone-induced respiratory symptoms, changes in pulmonary function (as measured by FEV1), and markers of airway inflammation.
Both Balmes and Frampton found that a subject's airway responsiveness to methacholine did not correlate with the reduction in FEV1 observed after ozone exposure. Moreover, normal subjects who were characterized as being most sensitive or least sensitive to ozone (by measurements of FEV1) did not differ in their ozone-induced inflammatory responses. This implies that even if pulmonary function does not change, other potentially harmful effects of ozone, such as airway inflammation, may occur. Balmes found that breathing ozone caused similar changes in FEV1 in normal and asthmatic subjects. However, 18 hours after exposure to 0.02 ppm ozone for four hours, the levels of some markers of inflammation in lung fluids from asthmatic subjects were higher than the levels observed in normal subjects. Although this suggests that when people with asthma are exposed to ozone, they may develop more intense respiratory tract inflammation than healthy people, further studies are needed at multiple time points after exposure.
Dr. Frampton and colleagues found that although smokers have a greater degree of underlying airway inflammation than nonsmokers, they actually had smaller ozone-induced decrements in FEV1 than nonsmokers. The magnitude of the inflammatory response to ozone was similar in smokers and nonsmokers. It was also the same in subjects characterized as most sensitive and least sensitive to ozone on the basis of their FEV1 responses. The investigators found that some compounds (called cytokines) that are known to be important mediators of inflammation were present immediately after exposure to ozone. However, the overall inflammatory response was greater 18 hours after ozone exposure (when lung function had returned toward normal levels) than immediately after exposure.
An unexpected finding of the collaborative study was that the effects of the bronchoscopic procedures used to obtain the airway fluids and biopsy specimens may persist for many weeks in some subjects. This has critical implications for studies involving repeated invasive procedures.
The results of the studies reported here suggest that measuring symptoms and pulmonary function (using standard measurements of air flow) may not be sufficient to evaluate the potential risks associated with ozone exposure. Many individuals experience airway inflammation after being exposed to ozone, and this response is not reflected in the FEV1 response. The significance of ozone-induced inflammation in terms of subsequent airway disease has not been determined. More attention needs to be directed toward assessing the effects of ozone on small airway function and toward developing noninvasive measurements of airway inflammation.
expert wrote on 7/13/2009 9:21 am
to jdlphki
...thank you for caring enough about asthma facts to check them out. I appreciate it.
expert wrote on 7/13/2009 9:15 am
to jdlehkpi??? whatever
Keep reading you are getting there go to EPA, NEJM, ANAAA, CDC, WHO, websites.
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 9:04 am
So these quotes from the NDRC (National Resources Defense Council) are supposed to convince us? They say:
"Studies have shown..."
but they don't say which studies.
They tell us that:
"Around 81 million people live in areas that fail to meet national air quality standards for particulate matter."
but they don't bother to tell us which areas those are and precisely WHAT is causing the poor air quality.
They quite specifically don't tell us just HOW the addition of an Intermodal in Gardner is going to affect our city by telling us how much particulate pollution we can expect, how it will be dispersed over the area, etc.
Interestingly, the Army Corps of Engineers actually DID that study in its 404 Evaluation Assessment. Are they "ignorant" too, Expert, because they don't read NRDC's environmental website?
expert wrote on 7/13/2009 8:40 am
To those with Asthma or any airway disease or any one who thinks the increase in pollution wont effect their breathing
from the NRDC
•Particulate Matter: This term refers to a wide range of pollutants -- dust, soot, fly ash, diesel exhaust particles, wood smoke and sulfate aerosols -- which are suspended as tiny particles in the air. Some of these fine particles can become lodged in the lungs and could trigger asthma attacks. Studies have shown that the number of hospitalizations for asthma increases when levels of particulate matter in the air rise. Coal-fired power plants, factories and diesel vehicles are major sources of particulate pollution. Around 81 million people live in areas that fail to meet national air quality standards for particulate matter.
wrote on 7/13/2009 8:22 am
I am glad the fairy tell three love being in la la land. We will see how long that last...
wrote on 7/13/2009 8:05 am
A big thank you to Thompson, Peters and Shepherd! Keep up the good work for those who care about their community.
Expert wrote on 7/13/2009 8:02 am
To JDPHKI and CBP
First of all your ignorance floors me you dont have to be in the Medical field to know about the studies and facts on the effects of particulate matter on those sensitive and especially those with reactive ariway diesease. This is taken from the EPA's website out of an artical on outdoor air and asthma.
Small particles and ozone come from things like exhaust from cars and factories, smoke and road dust. When inhaled, outdoor pollutants can aggravate the lungs, and can lead to chest pain, coughing, shortness of breath and throat irritation. Outdoor air pollution may also worsen chronic respiratory diseases, such as asthma. On days when ozone air pollution is highest, ozone has been associated with 10-20% of all respiratory hospital visits and admissions.
Anyone with a brain knows most people with reactive airway disease have trouble with exhaust emissions so......since you and CBP are so ignorant to the facts on asthma and i think this will be my last post to either of you on the subject,this is like having a discussion with a brick wall, go educate yourself on the matter and then maybe we can have an educated discussion instead of this nonsensical one.
jdelphiki wrote on 7/13/2009 7:32 am
So Expert, what exactly are you an expert in again?
Your experience as a nurse who worked with an allergist probably DOES give you some extra knowledge about the workings of allergy shots, but you seem to expect us to believe that it ALSO makes you an expert in the environmental impact of the Intermodal. Did you spend ten years working at an intermodal as well? Or maybe you helped write the Army Corps of Engineers 404 Environmental Assessment.
Asthma is not something to be laughed at. It's a serious ailment that IS made worse by a wide variety of irritants and airborne triggers. My own asthma didn't kick in until I was an adult and the worst attacks I've had involved my running around in a hayfield. I don't recall ever having problems with an asthma attack from being around big trucks. Even the big, truck-filled shipping ports on the East Coast didn't cause me any grief.
I know that my own experience doesn't speak for all asthmatics and I don't presume to imply that it does. At the same time, I don't know that you're being entirely accurate when you tell us that the experiences of some of the worst cases of asthma will automatically apply to everyone in Gardner because of the Intermodal.
We DO get that diesel smoke is a pollutant and an irritant that can cause respitory problems, especially in those who are already sensitive to it. What we DON'T get, and what the folks who continue to preach doom and gloom about the Intermodal keep avoiding, are realistic, objective stats that show a correlation between high-concentration areas of diesel smoke (like, for instance, a truck stop) and increases in ailments for people who spend a lot of time there (like, truck stop workers).
Show us stats that illustrate how the people who live next to the tracks here in Gardner (and would thereby be consuming the smoke from 80 trains a day) have higher incidences of asthma than the rest of Gardner or the metro.
Show us something other than wild assumptions and you'll have a better time in selling your expert opinion.
Of course, we'll STILL have to deal with the Intermodal because it'll still be built.
Linda wrote on 7/13/2009 7:17 am
Yes, i did it was a report about the water, which was why i got on the subject. Water ahmm? Better be concerned about the air.
Argentine is/was an intermodal. It was BNSF's transcon main and the intermodal here will replace it and then we can all look forward to kooking, smelling, living and turning into the next Argentine railyard district. Lovely.
Expert wrote on 7/13/2009 6:58 am
To CPB
I am a 30 + yrs Registered Nurse and worked for an allergist for 10 years. You are in good shape today because you received those shots. Many people with Asthma/Allergies dont smell money when they inhale even tiny amounts of exhaust, they definatly can and many do have ariway inflammation and constriction from it and the worst of those a trip to the ER. An increase in exhaust fumes(and it wont be miniscule if an intermodal logistics park comes to your town or near it) in the area will have a direct and profound effect on those exhaust sensitive people and not just the people with airway sensitivity but also those with high blood pressure, migraines and the like. Be prepared.
CPB wrote on 7/13/2009 12:05 am
The Argentine District smells different because of the river.
CPB wrote on 7/12/2009 11:52 pm
The shots that I had for 11 years basically introduced my body to the items that I was allergic to so that my body learned how to deal with them. Just like people will get used to the minuscule extra amount of exhaust that the inter modal project will induce. I enjoy the smell of diesel fuel. It smells like $$$$. Did you even read the report from the Army Corps?
wrote on 7/12/2009 8:45 pm
why bother, seems you are only going to allow the continual debate between your chosen few and then only if it is in ragards to the Gardner city council. I wont bother with your website any more.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/12/2009 8:38 pm
The good thing about Mr. Hale is not even John and Dan could not deny he was a great nomination and could not deny his expertise was exceptional.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/12/2009 8:37 pm
The good thing about Mr. Hale is not even John and Dan could not deny he was a great nomination and could deny his expertise was exceptional.
wrote on 7/12/2009 8:01 pm
To me the bar was set about as low as it can go with Mr. Hale and all you have to do is read his words on his last article on this site and be familiar with his past words, actions and inaction. Mr. Drovetta most definitely appointed one of his own.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/12/2009 6:55 pm
The majority won't fell. Then we be able to see what the council looks like. Sure the Mayor will try to top his last appointment, yet I know that will be hard. Topping Mr.Hale will be a big chore...
wrote on 7/12/2009 6:46 pm
So you get a whole new council and it is a new ball game thus why the Allen Group heavily bankrolled three candidates for office. So glad the people voted for true representatives rather than paid ones for the Allen Group/BNSF. Sometimes integrity and ethics win out over the money mongers and this may well have been one of those instances.
Semantics wrote on 7/12/2009 6:33 pm
The agreements were approved by a vote of a properly seated council.
They weren't signed becuase the county piece wasn't finished yet and then BNSF delayed their project.
wrote on 7/12/2009 6:02 pm
Those agreements were not signed so they were not rescinded per se.
There is a difference between an intermodal and inland port also.
Heath wrote on 7/12/2009 3:53 pm
Actually, I have several dear friends in Stanley and learned a great deal about their fight against annexation. Some of whom served on the No Annexation committee where I helped them with some of their marketing materials and mailings. Much like Gardner, they were the majority, yet the Council chose to work against them in what was seen by many as a ahow of power. In Gardner, we had 2 newly elected officials flex their new political power by rescinding an already agreed upon proposal that had the support of the people. What's different...aside from which side you support?
Am I part of the problem wrote on 7/12/2009 3:47 pm
@333
I have just one question. Do you even know what an intermodal is? Explain to me what you think it is. Argentine is not just an intermodal, so your statement there is not correct.
wrote on 7/12/2009 3:38 pm
Heath: You don't even understand the issue of the Overland Park annexation or what I was saying evidently and I am sure not going to sit here and educate you.
Heath wrote on 7/12/2009 3:34 pm
To 12:30, I find it hilarious that you speak out against the JoCo Commission for disregarding the voice of the people when moving forward with the OP annexation. Is that not the exact same thing taking place in The City of Garnder, yet we are bafoons for expecting more from our elected officials on the City Council. Need I remind you that the public speakers at each of the last 2 Council meetings spoke in resounding support of the annexation. You say that you hope Watson puts the screws to them, does that mean you would support BNSF and TAG if they were to pursue a suit against the city? Seems like failed logic to me.
wrote on 7/12/2009 3:33 pm
Once again, MOVING is not an answer. Look at the Argentine area that is what we will see and SMELL and that is what our home prices will do too and that is also the kind of neighborhoods we will eventually have. We might not be a big town but our property is worth something and our air is cleaner than the inner city air and by sitting back with our heads in the sand acting like its not such a bad idea we are bending over and taking one in the behind. SOooo if soemone has some real answers and solutions to the problem we need to hear them. Then maybe if we all invested the amount of energy into the solution as we do into this stupid blog we could be part of the fix, please just dont say MOVE if you dont like it that is so lame
Am I part of the problem? wrote on 7/12/2009 3:16 pm
@306
Life is too short the way things are already. Anger/negativity will make your lifespan even shorter.
Did you ever think this intermodal facility may not be as bad as everyone is saying?
If you can't get past that, maybe you should consider doing something about how you feel and move. That is something you have full control over. If it brings you happiness, how can you put a price that?
wrote on 7/12/2009 3:06 pm
No, I am a very angry person with elected officials, BNSF, the Allen Group and other specials interests who will make my life miserable and charge me an arm and leg to do so. They took a very happy, content citizen who has always contributed to their community in so many ways and turned them into someone who longer trusts anything they say or do and that was brought on by their actions, not mine.
1:58 wrote on 7/12/2009 2:34 pm
It is good that the city provides you something to complain about. Same tired old griping no offer to make things better just griping.
Cities need economic development whether you like it or not.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/12/2009 2:26 pm
Droveta, Winters, Hale, answered all emails, why not the other three? Didn't have good answers? Didn't like questions? wanted to continue secrecy?
Am I part f the problem wrote on 7/12/2009 2:08 pm
@146
What's the matter? I don't hear any answers coming from you. Tell me your solutions. Or would you have to repeat yourself by crying about pollution, poison air, or how you have to live near an intermodal.
It's coming, like it or not, why fight with the people trying to make a difference in our community.
Linda wrote on 7/12/2009 1:45 pm
I thought this post was for responses to the 404 public notice, how'd we get back on the tiring subject of the Gardner city council?
wrote on 7/12/2009 1:38 pm
I am personally tired of hearing the cop out statement of "Move if you dont like it" give an anwere to the solution or dont bother posting please its getting old. Moving is not a solution. And as far as people using no names some of us due to our jobs need to be more discret than others so get over that too an opinion is still an opinion.
wrote on 7/12/2009 1:30 pm
Paul Jones: Winters has never, never answered my e-mails, thanked me for info I have sent - nothing, nada, zero so don't put him up there with the liberty flag because he doesn't deserve it. And if you had a brain in your head you would realize why you got a reply from Winters.
wrote on 7/12/2009 1:23 pm
Bend a knee - you know exactly what I am talking about and you have had elected officials and many others bending the knee to BNSF and the Allen Group and others for years. But they sure haven't been bending the knee for the average citizen. You haven't seen many true public servants in this town until last April brought a few more on board much to the dismay of the money and greed mongers.
You must have very little respect for Peters, Thompson and Shepherd to think they cannot think for themselves and make their own decisions - they are not influenced by what Fotovich had to say but I do feel they may have very much agreed with what he had to say but there again they can speak for themselves. Fotovich is the not the mayor of Gardner - he does not owe you or any other citizen a thing or have to stay here and listen to people like you and take your crud - if he wants to move I can truly understand why he would want something better for his family.
Am I part of the problem? wrote on 7/12/2009 12:46 pm
@ comment made at 1230 - "Bend a knee to them" - What are you talking about? Are you serious?
Blame Fotovich? He is the one that influenced the current council majority in their vote, and now he is leaving. He helped create the current situation the city is in and now is jumping ship. Transparency in government? His actions are going to let people see right through him.
If he is so concerned about the welfare of Gardner why is he leaving? Just last April this town was good enough for him to want to be mayor for a term. Common - let's take back Gardner.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/12/2009 12:26 pm
Lets all remember, we can email Mr. Winters on the progress of new talks regarding the Inter-modal project...He answered all my many emails,good and bad ones, unlike Mr. Shepard. (answered "O")
Concerned Gardner Citizen wrote on 7/12/2009 12:18 pm
@ The environmental/health impact
You wrote:
"If the intermodal is coming and we can't stop it, vigilance by the local citizens will be necessary. If we aren't vigilant and don't continue to hold BNSF and TAG accountable someday we'll get a visit from Erin Brockovich.
Businesses will try to operate as lean as possible, and ignoring the enviroment is less expensive than being responsible. Handling and helping dispose of hazardous materials is big business, profitable business.
Should Gardner successfully annex the property, and work in concert with BNSF/TAG it is the RESPONSIBILTY of the Mayor, City Council, and City Administrators to be vigilant and ensure the health and welfare of our citizens."
That's part of the reason why de-annexing the land is such a huge mistake.
The environmental/health impact ... wrote on 7/12/2009 10:52 am
If the intermodal is coming and we can't stop it, vigilance by the local citizens will be necessary. If we aren't vigilant and don't continue to hold BNSF and TAG accountable someday we'll get a visit from Erin Brockovich.
Businesses will try to operate as lean as possible, and ignoring the enviroment is less expensive than being responsible. Handling and helping dispose of hazardous materials is big business, profitable business.
Should Gardner successfully annex the property, and work in concert with BNSF/TAG it is the RESPONSIBILTY of the Mayor, City Council, and City Administrators to be vigilant and ensure the health and welfare of our citizens.
To think otherwise, "Concerned Gardner Resident", shows a lack of respect for all citizens of Gardner
wrote on 7/12/2009 10:36 am
Concerned Gardner Citizen: Your train of thought is exactly what the old status quo and many still want. They want to turn their heads from the environmental concerns and really don't care about suffering of the people (look how posters on this site made fun of Mrs. Peters for wanting to bring in an expert with respect to environmental concerns and then you have the Solies talk about being respectable and civil - this site doesn't know the definition or practice the meaning of those words), they see the project only with the dollar bill in mind and those dollars will only be seen by the few, they want only to take care of the special interests and they continue to sell the fairy tale that the project can be managed and controlled. You have been controlled for the past 4 years and you still don't recognize it or want to. We need a new and ongoing Declaration of Independence wherein the people decide what is best for their community and not by the likes of Lehman, Drovetta, city administration, Jo. Co. Commissioners and other elected officials who cater to and enable the special interests to exploit our people. They are governing for those who constantly are in your halls of government with their hands out and giving the people the thumbed nose and the hand gesture. You have these people to thank for this killing project and you, too, are all so willing to get on the band wagon.
Well, just remember there are those who disagree with you entirely and are not ready to just roll over and say make the best of it - there is no making the best of it - best just doesn't even enter the picture.
Concerned Gardner Citizen wrote on 7/12/2009 10:10 am
Why debate the environmental/health impact of this intermodal? Will continuing to debate the environmental impact make the intermodal go elsewhere? No.
Will the intermodal have less of an impact on the citizens of Gardner if it's part of Edgerton, or Johnson County? No.
If you believe the intermodal is coming (whether we like it or not) the only issue worthy of debate is should it be part of Gardner, or not.
If you still think we can make the intermodal go away, you're not looking at the facts surrounding this project objectively.
Is it POSSIBLE that the intermodal will go away? Sure, anything's possible. Is it PROBABLE that the intermodal will go away? No.
If you're managing a City government and focusing on possibilities while ignoring probabilities, you're not performing your duties in the best interest of your constituents.
As a for instance: If you liquidate your retirement plan and use the proceeds to buy Powerball tickets, it's possible that you could retire much wealthier. But, it's not probable.
If you wouldn't manage your future by acting upon possibilities rather than probabilities, why would you let your City Council manage your City's future that way?
wrote on 7/12/2009 9:01 am
Man is slowly asphyxiating himself. Makes me think of the old movie Soylent Green, Guess I can be like the majority and keep my head in the sand.
Today wrote on 7/12/2009 7:17 am
What about all the emmissions today? Trains roll through town now, trucks on the highway now, tractors working the farms now, school buses running now, trucks delivering to New Century now. There are regs that went into effect in 2007 that will continue to make diesel cleaner.
Particulate matter is not just a part of diesel, its in auto exhaust, lawn mower exhaust, field burning, dust from unpaved roads, fire places, barbeque grills, anything where there is combustion.......
Asthmatic.... wrote on 7/11/2009 9:59 pm
To Paul Jones, you need to educate yourself from an expert, not someone who is ignorant and who obviously doesnt have problems anymore(probaby because they got DESNSITIZED with shots for 11 years). Oh, and CBP if you lived on a farm, you would probably be bothered by something around there like the hay or grass (no not that.... that was probably one of the ingredients in your allergy shots as a kid, amen to your Mother who made you get those shots or you would probably be choking on something still)since it sounds like at one time you WERE prone to airway irritation, you may get used to any farm things that may bother you, only to exchange it for another irritant that wasnt in your 11 YEARS worth of allergy shots.... like exhaust fumes
Linda G wrote on 7/11/2009 9:25 pm
To CBP
Uhh duh, did you ever think your 11 years of shots is probably why your asthma or allergies dont bother you today and maybe your are not sensitive to exhaust fumes? Most people with Asthma, even those well controlled by using anti inflammatories/bronchodilators (like myself)and even those who had shots still are bothered by exhaust, still feel the burn after being behind those vehicals. Given your medical history, you will more than likely have problems on some level eventually and when you do good luck convincing yourself that you have risen above it since you seem to think you are mighty enough to "will it" away. And myfriend I hope for you that vehical exhaust doesnt bother you or your fresh air will feel like poison to you.
Edgerton Gal wrote on 7/11/2009 9:08 pm
To Linda G. and wrote on: We have caring hearts and souls only to be slammed by the people who have been "duped" into thinking that there will be millions and millions of dollars coming our way from the BNSF project and flip our health off. The only thing left I guess is to cling to our Bibles and faith and consult with the American Lung Association and Hospice (end of life care) for support. (I awakened on July 5th after the big 4th of July fumes in my house hoarse and with congestion; recovered somewhat by today only to be exposed again trying to clean up the yard.)
wrote on 7/11/2009 8:41 pm
To Edgerton Gal.... I hear ya sister, its a shame and its just going to keep on and keep on until there isnt anymore ",clean fresh country air" to breath. I guess mankind is really going to cause his own extinction he will asphyxiate eventually.
Linda wrote on 7/11/2009 8:33 pm
To CBP:
Not using asthma as an excuse. (I workout doing 6 hrs of cardio a week although the only reason this is possible is because of an inhaled anti inflammatory, advair 500, twice a day) There are no shots for diesel fume sensitivity and no you do not get used to it or I would have grown accustomed to it 40 years ago when i was just starting to choke on it, its very irritating. I remember as a kid growing up on Brookside in Kansas city, living on a street (Wornall rd) where city buses and various traffic ran all day (By the way I didnt have asthma then but did notice how exhaust fumes burnt my nose and lungs and eyes and just all together stunk) Anyway, I remember thinking when I grow up Im living in the country where the air smells good and clean and there isnt a ton of noisy stinky traffic that never stops (day or night). So here I am 46 and getting ready for the non stop stinky traffic I finally had gotten mostly away from and im thinking what poor kid who thinks the trucks stink is really gonna get blasted half his life with fumes, move away from it only to develope Asthma later down the road. Im the first person who you wont see letting asthma or allergies be an excuse or a crutch. Asthma is very real, if you had it or allergies to any degree you would know this. In my last post,the point I was trying to make was, diesel is very irritating and probably more toxic then we realize, I know our country depends on transportation in this fashion so moving away would not be an answere because it would just follow you. I know trying to fight for clean air anywhere in our country would be fruitless but I guarentee you the exhaust will bother people sensitive to it and exacerbate their symptoms and probably be the direct cause of someones future problem with asthma and you know what? It will probably some little kid who thinks when they grow up they are moving away from the noise and the stink just like i USED to and we can all Thank BNSF for adding some more killer air to our clean country air.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/11/2009 7:33 pm
By the way no name it is when it is built, not if. IF, is gone...
Paul Jones wrote on 7/11/2009 7:31 pm
No name please let me know when your home is on the market, so I can see about one of my daughters would be interested.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/11/2009 7:28 pm
You might check it out for the past 10 years,then we will have something to compare to. Thanks for the concern though. To bad we could not have a few more city council members hadnt remembered we would still have to spend our tax dollars on road repairs ect., yet we could of gotten some tax dollars off the project, down the road for studys and repairs down the road...
wrote on 7/11/2009 7:25 pm
I would encourage every homeowner to put their home on the market. If the intermodal comes, you will not want to live here, that is, if you want any quality of life whatsoever. If you want to live in an industrial setting and want your health adversely affected and don't mind dodging millions of trucks, then definitely stay and maybe you can be a slum lord.
gardner citizen wrote on 7/11/2009 7:13 pm
Looks like BNSF got exactly what they wanted no suprise. Now all they need is to steal taxpayer money to build infrastructure and help pay for the project that supposidly is not going to cause enviromental impacts. Lets see how many times this area of the county has a red ozone day when this thing gets built. Not sure where they nearest sensor in this are is that checks this.
Paul Jones wrote on 7/11/2009 6:38 pm
Thanks CPB! I don't have asthma, so I really learned something from your comments.
CPB wrote on 7/11/2009 6:24 pm
Asthma and allergies are not a good excuse. I've had asthma my whole life. I had allergy shots from 5 years old till I decided that I didn't want them anymore at age 16. My body has become accustomed to the world that I live in and I rarely have any more problems. The only thing that really bothers me is Hay. I'm sure that if I lived on a farm for a few years my body would become accustomed to it as well. Also, it was worse when I was in bad shape. You can use asthma as an excuse, and you may get some sympathy from those that don't have it. For those that have it and choose to deal with it though, it is annoying to hear it used as an excuse. The inter modal is on it's way. If you don't like it, put your house up for sale.
Yes wrote on 7/11/2009 2:05 pm
We keep it up and Gardner will be part of Olathe soon...or Egderton.
Olathe wrote on 7/11/2009 1:44 pm
Did anyone notice that the proposed "Olathe" site was really in Gardner?
Paul Jones wrote on 7/10/2009 7:53 pm
It is a free world, if you cant find something good about Gardner then why say anything. The serenity prayer might help you, it does me...
Linda G. wrote on 7/10/2009 7:35 pm
Tell that to someone with Asthma and Allergies. Truck and train emissions will have a sigificant effect on them. People with asthma who are sensitive to exhaust fumes (most are)very often have immediate symptoms(coughing, wheezing and or shortness of breath) after being near some vehicles exhaust and especially after riding behind one on the road. In addition to the initial symtoms you then feel like you have a head and chest cold for a day or two. According to the CDC, roughly 8-10% of the nation has Asthma that means there will be close to two thousand people(thats close to the size of Edgertons entire population) with an increase in breathing difficulties. I being a person with Asthma and Allergies thinks the increase in truck traffic will have not only an impact but a significant impact of my health and well being. Thanks BNSF for polluting my air more than it already is
AGR wrote on 7/10/2009 6:14 pm
This looks like some good reading...
Concerned Gardner Citizen wrote on 7/10/2009 5:57 pm
Raise your hand if you still think the intermodal is going away.
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